Sugyot, sources, the underlying chakirah, machlokot of the Rishonim and Acharonim,
nafka minot for halakhah and examination of the shitot
Subject:
שולחן ערוך יורה דעה סימן קפ״ט — thirty-four seifim
with the commentaries: ש״ך (שפתי כהן), ט״ז (טורי זהב), ב״י, טור, ופתחי תשובה
Root of the sugya in Shas:
נדה ס״ג ע״ב — the mishnah of establishing and uprooting three times · נדה ט׳ ע״א — the question of וסתות דאורייתא
Written and edited by:
הרב יוסף חיים סממה · DAAT
📑 Table of contents
The nature of the chashash of a veset — de-oraita or de-rabanan, and why a merely possible sighting forbids the onah (seifim 1 and 4)
The logic of the chazakot — three times to establish, the onah beinonit treated as a fixed veset, and the gap between fixed and non-fixed (seifim 1 and 4)
Establishing a veset and the haflagah — why the veset of intervals needs four sightings, and the veset of hours (seifim 2 and 3)
Dilug and sirug — counting the intervals, the days of the month and the days of the week (seifim 5 to 12)
The rule of day and night — a veset is established within a single onah (seif 13)
Uprooting a veset — change, uprooting in three, and the veset returning to its place (seifim 14 to 16)
Veset by ones and veset of the body — the ones that does not establish on its own, and the test of הוברר הדבר (seifim 17 to 23)
Mesuleket damim — ketanah, zekenah, meuberet and menikah, and the veset within a veset (seifim 27 to 34)
« כל אשה שאין לה וסת קבוע חוששת ליום ל׳ לראייתה שהיא עונה בינונית לסתם נשים ואם יש לה וסת קבוע לזמן ידוע מכ׳ לכ׳ או מכ״ה לכ״ה חוששת לזמן הידוע » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:א)
Translation. Every woman who has no fixed veset is concerned for the thirtieth day from her sighting, which is the onah beinonit of women in general; and if she has a fixed veset at a known term — from the twentieth to the twentieth, or from the twenty-fifth to the twenty-fifth — she is concerned for that known term.
1. The nature of the chashash of a veset — de-oraita or de-rabanan
The foundation of the siman: a woman is concerned for the day on which she is accustomed to see — not because she has seen, but because her body is accustomed to see on that day. From this comes the whole difficulty: how can an onah be forbidden on the strength of a sighting that is not certain but only possible? The principle is that the veset generates a re'uta and a chazakah that she will see blood; and where a chazakah of seeing stands, the body no longer stands in a chazakah of purity. That is why seif 1 uses the verb חוששת — she is concerned — and not "she is impure".
The great chakirah — וסתות דאורייתא or דרבנן: the Amoraim are divided over the standing of the vesatot. The gemara puts the question in these very words:
« אַלִּיבָּא דְּמַאן דְּאָמַר וְסָתוֹת דְּאוֹרָיְיתָא » (נדה ט׳ ע״א) If the vesatot are de-oraita, the chazakah of seeing that rests on the onah of the veset is a Torah prohibition itself. If they are de-rabanan, there is here only a concern instituted by the Chakhamim, and the body remains fundamentally in its chazakah of purity so long as she has not seen. The siman does not decide this question in its own name; it leaves it open, and the commentaries make use of both sides.
The nafka mina of the chakirah, as the commentaries actually work it: the Shakh returns more than once within this siman to the de-rabanan side in order to incline toward leniency — notably at ס״ק מ״ט, ע״ג and ע״ה. At seif 17 he brings the Rishonim who do not establish a veset for the days alone:
« וכ״כ הרב המגיד בשם הרמב״ן דמסתברא כיון דוסתות דרבנן נקטינן לקולא » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק מ״ט) at seif 33 he defends the Mechaber's lenient ruling against the objection of the Bach, and closes on this principle:
« ותו דהא קי״ל וסתות דרבנן ואזלי׳ בהו לקולא בכמה דוכתי » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ע״ג) and at seif 34 he wonders why the Mechaber omitted the view of the Ramban and the Raavad, leaning on the same principle:
« ועוד דהא בוסתות דרבנן שומעין להקל » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ע״ה) This is the chakirah at work: not a speculation, but the lever with which the Shakh lifts rulings of the Mechaber. The question itself remains open in the siman; what is established is that the Shakh draws a leniency from it wherever he can.
What the siman says, and what it does not: siman 189 nowhere defines the standing of the vesatot — it assumes the question settled elsewhere and devotes itself entirely to the mechanics of establishing and uprooting. A reader looking for the regime of perishah samukh le-veset must go to siman 184, to which the Shakh himself refers within this siman:
« ואסורה לבעלה לשלשים עד שתבדוק » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ז׳) And in practice — ask your Rav.
2. The logic of the chazakot — three times to establish
The whole architecture of the siman rests on the law of chazakah: how a veset is established, and how it is uprooted.
The language of the Mechaber (seif 4)
« עוד יש חילוק בין קבעתו ג׳ פעמים ללא קבעתו ג׳ פעמים שהקבוע אף על פי שעברה עונתה ולא הרגישה אסורה לשמש עד שתבדוק ותמצא טהורה ושלא קבעתו ג״פ אם הגיע זמן הוסת ולא בדקה ולא ראתה כיון שעברה עונתה מותרת » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ד)
« ועונה בינונית שהיא לל׳ יום דינה כוסת קבוע » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ד — carrying the attribution הרשב״א)
Translation. "There is a further difference between one who established it three times and one who did not establish it three times: she who established it — even though her onah passed and she felt nothing — is forbidden to her husband until she examines herself and finds herself pure; and she who did not establish it three times — if the term of the veset arrived, and she neither examined herself nor saw, since her onah has passed she is permitted." And: "the onah beinonit, which is at the thirtieth day, has the status of a fixed veset." This last clause carries in the text the attribution הרשב״א; editions differ as to whether it belongs to the Mechaber or is an addition — we give it as the source presents it, without deciding.
The foundation — three times make a chazakah.
The mishnah in Niddah states the rule in both directions at once, and the whole siman flows from that symmetry:
« שֶׁאֵין אִשָּׁה קוֹבַעַת לָהּ וֶסֶת עַד שֶׁתִּקְבָּעֶנָּה שָׁלֹשׁ פְּעָמִים, וְאֵינָהּ מִטַּהֶרֶת מִן הַוֶּסֶת עַד שֶׁתֵּעָקֵר מִמֶּנָּה שָׁלֹשׁ פְּעָמִים » (נדה ס״ג ע״ב) Translation: "a woman does not establish a veset for herself unless she establishes it three times, and she is not cleared of the veset unless it is uprooted from her three times."
Three like sightings generate a full chazakah: from now on the body is held to see at this onah. From this follow two substantive differences between the fixed and the non-fixed:
• In the fixed veset — even though the onah passed and she felt nothing, she is forbidden until she examines herself, for the chazakah says she may have seen without feeling it.
• In the non-fixed veset — the onah passed with no examination and no sighting → she is permitted, for there is here no chazakah that compels an examination.
The nature of the "onah beinonit" — a concern owed to women in general: the onah beinonit (the thirtieth day) is not this woman's veset. Seif 1 defines it as עונה בינונית לסתם נשים(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:א) — most women do not space two sightings more than thirty days apart. And that is why the text gives it the status of a fixed veset even as to the stringency of examination: without having been established by three sightings, the chazakah of the majority stands in for the chazakah of the individual. The Shakh draws the practical consequence and refers to siman 184:
« ואסורה לבעלה לשלשים עד שתבדוק » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ז׳) This is a considerable chiddush: a chazakah of majority here counts as a chazakah acquired through three sightings.
The logic of uprooting — three against three: just as the chazakah is established by three, so it is uprooted only by three. Seif 15 says so in as many words:
« נעקר וסת הראשון ואין לה וסת כלל ואם חזרה לראות ביום הוסת הראשון חוזר לקביעותו הראשון וחוששת לו תמיד עד שיעקר ממנה שלש פעמים » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ט״ו) Measure for measure: a chazakah built in three does not fall apart in one, for one does not remove a chazakah except by a re'uta of equal weight. This is the pillar of the laws of uprooting in seifim 14 to 16.
3. Establishing a veset and the haflagah — why four sightings
« כיצד קובעתו כגון שתראה ד׳ פעמים וביניהם ג׳ זמנים שוין כגון שראתה היום ולסוף כ׳ יום פעם אחרת ועוד לסוף כ׳ יום ועוד לסוף כ׳ יום וזה נקרא וסת ההפלגות ולכך צריכה ד׳ ראיות שראיה ראשונה אינה מן המנין לפי שאינה בהפלגה » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ב)
« ואפי׳ קודם שקבעתו שלש פעמים חוששת שמיד אחר שראתה פעם אחת לסוף כ׳ חוששת מכאן ואילך כשיגיע כ׳ » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ב)
« אם קבעה וסת לשעות ולא לימים אינה חוששת אלא שעתה בלבד והוסת הזה הוא נעקר בשעה אחת ואפי׳ בלא בדיקה » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ג)
Translation. Seif 2: "How does she establish it? For instance, if she sees four times with three equal intervals between them — she saw today, then at the end of twenty days another time, then again at the end of twenty days, then again at the end of twenty days; and this is called the וסת ההפלגות. That is why four sightings are needed, for the first sighting does not enter the count, since it is not an interval." And: "even before she has established it three times she is concerned, for immediately after she has seen once at the end of twenty she is concerned from then on whenever the twentieth arrives." Seif 3: "If she established a veset for hours and not for days, she is concerned only for her hour alone; and this veset is uprooted in a single hour, and even without an examination."
The foundation — why the veset of intervals needs four sightings.
A haflagah is not a date: it is a distance between two sightings. And a distance cannot be measured with a single sighting — two are needed for one interval to exist at all. Hence:
• sighting no. 1 → is no interval at all (there is nothing before it to be distant from) → שראיה ראשונה אינה מן המנין לפי שאינה בהפלגה(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ב);
• sightings nos. 2, 3, 4 → generate three equal intervals → a chazakah.
In the veset of days (day of the month, day of the week), three sightings at a fixed date suffice, for each sighting is in itself "the first of the month" and needs no sighting before it. The Taz states this gap in one line:
« זהו בשאר וסתות אבל בוסת הפלגה שנזכר בתחילת סעיף זה צריך ב׳ פעמים שהרי ראיה הא׳ אינה מן המנין » (ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ג׳)
The veset of hours is uprooted in one hour: seif 3 carries a chiddush — a veset hanging on an hour rather than a day does not need three times to be uprooted; it is נעקר בשעה אחת ואפי׳ בלא בדיקה(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ג). The Taz explains what is meant: not an hour of the clock, but a moment tied to a cause — after her immersion, or other such things on account of which she is accustomed to see at that time(ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ד׳ — summary, not verbatim). One then sees why it yields so quickly: it is not a full chazakah like that of the days, but a thin chazakah attached to a narrow onah; once the hour has passed without a sighting, the chazakah refutes itself. This is the exception to the "three against three" logic of uprooting.
Where the count of intervals becomes a machloket: the Shakh, at seif 5, refuses to take for granted that four sightings suffice to establish a veset of dilug — he confines it to one of the two views in seif 7:
« משמע דבד׳ ראיות קבעה וסת לדילוג והיינו דוקא לדעת היש מחמירין דלקמן סעיף ז׳ » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ח׳) In other words, the number of sightings required is not a fixed datum of the siman: it depends on the view one follows at seif 7. And in practice — ask your Rav.
4. Dilug and sirug — the veset of the days of the month and of the week
« פעמים שתהיה ההפלגה שקובעת בהם הוסת בדילוג כגון שראתה היום וראתה שנית לסוף ל׳ ושלישית לל״א ורביעית לל״ב קבעה וסת לדילוג שלהפלגות » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ה)
« כשם שקובעת וסת בהפלגה מימים שוים ושאינם שוים כך קובעת בימי החדש ובימי השבוע שוים ושאינם שוים » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ו)
« כיצד קובעת בימי החדש בדילוג כגון שראתה בט״ו בניסן וט״ז באייר וי״ז בסיון לא קבעה וסת עד שתראה בי״ח בתמוז שאין ראיה ראשונה מצטרפת כיון שאין ההפלגות שוות » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ז)
« וסת הסירוג ראיה ראשונה מן המנין לדברי הכל ואע״פ שהרחיקה ראיותיה » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ב)
Translation. Seif 5: "Sometimes the interval by which she establishes her veset grows by steps — she saw today, a second time at the end of thirty, a third at the thirty-first, a fourth at the thirty-second: she has established a veset of dilug of intervals." Seif 6: "Just as she establishes a veset by intervals, equal or unequal, so she establishes by the days of the month and by the days of the week, equal or unequal." Seif 7: "How does she establish by the days of the month in dilug? For instance, if she saw on 15 Nisan, 16 Iyar and 17 Sivan — she has not established a veset until she sees on 18 Tammuz, for the first sighting does not join, since the intervals are not equal." Seif 12: "The veset of sirug: the first sighting enters the count according to all, even though she spaced her sightings."
The foundation — dilug against sirug.
Two parallel ways of establishing, and all the Taz's weight bears on what separates them:
• דילוג — the gap grows steadily (30, 31, 32…). Since it is built on a count of intervals → the first sighting does not enter the count, and four sightings are needed (the rule of the haflagot).
• סירוג — the sighting returns to a fixed date by skipping (Rosh Chodesh Nisan, Rosh Chodesh Sivan, Rosh Chodesh Av — she skips a month). Since this is a veset of dates → the first sighting enters the count according to all.
Counting the sightings — dilug of intervals, dilug of days, sirug:
Way of establishing
Count of sightings
Source
Dilug of intervals (30, 31, 32)
The first does not enter the count; four sightings are required
מחבר ס״ה · ט״ז ס״ק ג׳ · ש״ך ס״ק ח׳
Dilug of the days of the month (15, 16, 17)
She does not establish before the fourth sighting (18 Tammuz)
מחבר ס״ז
Sirug (Rosh Chodesh, skipping a month)
The first enters the count according to all
מחבר ס״ט וסי״ב · ט״ז ס״ק י״ב
The detail of the seifim — why sirug is different: in dilug it is the gap itself that is the object of the establishing; it therefore depends on the intervals, and the first sighting is not counted. In sirug the date is what is fixed (Rosh Chodesh), and the skipping is only the frequency of the return; that is why the first sighting "has already come at its term" and is counted. The Taz says so expressly, and holds that this applies even to the first of the two views in seif 7:
« וכאן הוה ר״ח ניסן מן המנין אפילו לדעה קמייתא » (ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק י״ב) — and the Taz goes on to refer to the seif where that view is found, with the printer's correction the editions carry (the text gives "seif ד׳" in parentheses and "ז׳" in brackets), concluding that four sightings are required there.
And this is what the Mechaber wrote at seif 12: ראיה ראשונה מן המנין לדברי הכל(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ב). Seif 11 adds that if she skipped once or twice she is not yet concerned for the dilug until she has established it, even though she is concerned for the other vesatot from the first time: « דילגה פעם אחת או שתים אינה חוששת לדילוג אע״פ שחוששת לשאר וסתות בפעם אחת אינה חוששת לוסת הדילוג עד שתקבענו » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״א).
Seifim 8 to 10 — the dilug that comes round again, and the sirug of the third month: seif 8 develops the dilug that repeats "in a cycle" (15 Nisan, 16 Iyar, 17 Sivan, then again 15 Tammuz, and so on), and rules that she then establishes a veset of dilug chalilah. Seif 9 deals with the sirug of Rosh Chodesh (1 Nisan, 1 Sivan, 1 Av → a veset of Rosh Chodesh by skipping). And seif 10 states the converse: if she broke the sequence in the third month, she has established nothing:
« ראתה ט״ו בניסן וט״ז באייר וי״ח בסיון לא קבעה וסת כיון שסירגה בחדש השלישי ולא ראתה עד י״ח בו » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י) All these cases follow a single logic: the intervals — or the skips — must be equal and unbroken. Seif 7 itself closes on a machloket that the Mechaber does not decide, concluding that one must be concerned for the stringent view: « וי״א שאע״פ שלא ראתה אלא בט״ו בניסן וט״ז באייר וי״ז בסיון קבעה וסת וחוששת לי״ח בתמוז וי״ט באב וכן לעולם ויש לחוש לדבריהם ולהחמיר » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ז).
5. The rule of day and night — a veset within a single onah
« אין האשה קובעת לה וסת אפילו ראתה שלשה ר״ח זה אחר זה אלא אם כן יהיו כולם בעונה אחת ביום או בלילה ואם ראתה שלש פעמים ביום והרביעית בלילה או שלש פעמים בלילה והרביעית ביום חוששת ביום ובלילה מפני חשש הוסת הראשון ומפני חשש השני שהוא האחרון » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ג)
Translation. "A woman does not establish a veset for herself — even if she saw three Rashei Chodashim one after the other — unless they are all within a single onah: by day, or by night. And if she saw three times by day and the fourth by night, or three times by night and the fourth by day, she is concerned by day and by night: on account of the concern of the first veset, and on account of the concern of the second, which is the last."
The foundation — the onah is the unit of time of the veset.
A veset is not established upon a "day" in the broad sense, but upon an עונה — a day or a night. Day and night are two distinct units in the laws of niddah. Hence: three sightings that do not all fall within a single onah (some by day, some by night) do not combine to establish, for there is no full chazakah upon any one onah.
Day and night mixed — a double concern, but of unequal weight: when she has seen three times by day and a fourth by night, the veset of the day is not yet established (the fourth sighting broke the sequence) and a new concern has been born for the night. The Mechaber therefore rules that she חוששת ביום ובלילה(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ג). The Shakh explains the phrase by comparison with seif 14:
« חוששת ביום ובלילה. דזה וזה אסורים כדלקמן סעיף י״ד » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק כ״ח) And the Taz shows that the two concerns do not carry the same weight — this is where the lamdan must stop:
« אותו שביום אינה נעקר עד שנעקר שלש פעמים ואותו שבלילה נעקר בפעם אחת שלא תראה בו עוד בלילה » (ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ט״ו) Translation: "the one of the day is not uprooted until it has been uprooted three times, and the one of the night is uprooted in a single time, once she no longer sees at night." One and the same sentence of the Mechaber therefore carries two concerns of opposite regimes: one held by an acquired chazakah, the other not.
6. Uprooting a veset — change and uprooting in three
Seifim 14 to 16 are the direct application of the logic of the chazakot: how an established chazakah comes apart.
The language of the Mechaber (seifim 14 to 16)
« היתה רגילה לראות יום עשרים » — gloss of the Rama: « ויש לה בזה וסת קבוע » — « ושינתה ליום שלשים זה וזה אסורים » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ד)
« שינתה ג״פ ליום ל׳ הותר יום כ׳ ונאסר יום ל׳ » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ד)
« שינתה ראיותיה ולא השוה אותם »… « נעקר וסת הראשון ואין לה וסת כלל ואם חזרה לראות ביום הוסת הראשון חוזר לקביעותו הראשון וחוששת לו תמיד עד שיעקר ממנה שלש פעמים » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ט״ו)
« עברו עליה שלשה ר״ח ולא ראתה אינה חוששת להם חזרה וראתה בר״ח חזר הוסת למקומו » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ט״ז)
Translation. Seif 14: "She was accustomed to see on the twentieth day — gloss of the Rama: and she has in this a fixed veset — and she changed to the thirtieth: both are forbidden. […] She changed three times to the thirtieth: the twentieth is permitted and the thirtieth forbidden." Seif 15: "She changed her sightings without making them equal […] the first veset is uprooted and she has no veset at all; and if she returned to see on the day of the first veset, it returns to its original establishment, and she is concerned for it always until it is uprooted from her three times." Seif 16: "Three Rashei Chodashim passed over her and she did not see — she is no longer concerned for them; she returned and saw on Rosh Chodesh — the veset has returned to its place."
The foundation — one uproots a chazakah only by a chazakah.
A fixed veset is a chazakah, and a chazakah is not uprooted in a single time. Hence two stages:
• The change — the first time she does not see at her term: זה וזה אסורים(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ד) — she is concerned both for the old day (still within its chazakah) and for the new one (where a concern has just been born).
• The uprooting — only after three times without a sighting at the old term (and establishment at the new one) → the old is permitted and the new forbidden.
And the Taz shows that the Rama's gloss at seif 14 is no ornament: without a veset that is already fixed, the concern for the twentieth day would fall away at the first omission:
« דאל״כ כיון דשינתה ולא ראתה ביום כ׳ נעקר חשש יום הך׳ כיון שאינו נקבע כבר בג״פ » (ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק כ״ו)
The veset returning to its place — the chiddush of seifim 15 and 16: if the veset was uprooted without another being established, and she חזרה לראות ביום הוסת הראשון(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ט״ו), the veset regains its establishment even in a single time, without needing three fresh sightings. The reason: the old chazakah was not erased but weakened; one sighting awakens it. The same holds for the uprooting of the Rosh Chodesh veset at seif 16: three Rashei Chodashim without a sighting → uprooted; a single Rosh Chodesh on her return → back in its place. The Shakh states the condition that bounds this chiddush — she must not have established another veset in the meantime:
« כל שלא שינתה בינתיים בג׳ ראיות אחרות ואחר כך חזרה לראות ביום הוסת הא׳ חזרה לקביעותו הא׳ וצריך ג׳ פעמים לעקרו » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק מ״ד)
What is left open: the Mechaber writes at seif 15 that a return to the first veset restores its establishment, and at seif 34 that a single sighting suffices to bring back the concern for the haflagah. The Taz himself notes that the two places must be read together — he refers from seif 34 back to the difficulty he had raised on seif 15 (ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק נ׳). We do not resolve that difficulty here: it remains open.And in practice — ask your Rav.
7. Veset by ones and veset of the body — הוברר הדבר
The language of the Mechaber and the Rama (seifim 17 to 23)
« כל וסת שנקבע מחמת אונס »… « אפילו ראתה בו כמה פעמים »… « אינו וסת שמפני האונס ראתה » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ז)
Glosses of the Rama, inside the body of the seif: « כגון שקפצה וראתה » and « ומ״מ חוששת לו כמו לוסת שאינו קבוע » (רמ״א שם — יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ז)
« קפצה ביום ידוע כגון בר״ח או בא׳ בשבת וראתה בו ואירע כן בג׳ ר״ח או בג׳ א׳ בשבת קבעה לה וסת וחוששת לכל פעם שתקפוץ באותו זמן » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ח)
« יש קובעת וסת על ידי מקרים שיארעו בגופה כגון שמפהקת »… « וכן אם מתעטשת דרך מטה או חוששת בפי כריסה ובשפולי מעיה »… « בכל א׳ מאלו אם יארע לה שלשה פעמים וראתה קבעה לה וסת » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ט)
« פיהקה ב׳ פעמים בר״ח וראתה ואחר כך פיהקה שלא בר״ח וראתה הוברר הדבר שאין ר״ח גורם אלא הפיהוק » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ)
Translation. Seif 17: "Any veset established on account of an ones — gloss of the Rama: for instance she jumped and saw — even if she saw at it several times […] is not a veset, for it is on account of the ones that she saw"; and the Rama adds: "and nonetheless she is concerned for it as for a non-fixed veset." Seif 18: "She jumped on a known day — for instance on Rosh Chodesh or on a Sunday — and saw on it, and this happened on three Rashei Chodashim or three Sundays: she has established a veset, and she is concerned every time she jumps at that time." Seif 19: "There are those who establish a veset through occurrences in their body, such as yawning […] likewise if she sneezes, or feels discomfort at the mouth of the belly and the lower intestines […] in each of these, if it happens to her three times and she sees, she has established a veset." Seif 20: "She yawned twice on Rosh Chodesh and saw, and afterwards she yawned on a day that was not Rosh Chodesh and saw — it has become clear that it is not Rosh Chodesh that causes it but the yawning."
The chakirah — veset of the body against veset of the days, and isolating the cause: the veset of the body (yawning, sneezing, discomfort in the belly — and, per the Rama's gloss at seif 23, garlic, onion and pepper) is established like the veset of days, by three times. But a sharp question arises: when the sighting comes both at a fixed date (Rosh Chodesh) and with a sign of the body (the yawn) — which of the two is the cause? This is the question of הוברר הדבר.
Isolating the cause — הוברר הדבר (seif 20): the Mechaber gives a protocol of separation:
She yawned twice on Rosh Chodesh, and the third time she yawned not on Rosh Chodesh and saw → « פיהקה ב׳ פעמים בר״ח וראתה ואחר כך פיהקה שלא בר״ח וראתה הוברר הדבר שאין ר״ח גורם אלא הפיהוק » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ) — the yawning is the cause, not the date. The Shakh states the consequence: « אלא הפיהוק. וקבעה וסת לפיהוק לבדו » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק נ״ז)
She yawned twice on Rosh Chodesh, and the third time she saw on Rosh Chodesh without yawning → « וכן אם בפעם השלישית ראתה בר״ח בלא פיהוק הוברר הדבר שאין הפיהוק גורם אלא הר״ח » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ) — Rosh Chodesh is the cause. And the Shakh: « אלא הראש חודש. וקבעה וסת לראש חודש לבדו » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק נ״ח)
This is an experiment in isolating a variable: one factor is varied, the other held fixed, and one sees which continues to establish. Seif 20 adds a third case, which is neither of these: if she yawned on the 29th of the month without seeing, and saw on Rosh Chodesh without yawning, she has established a veset to the yawning of the eve of Rosh Chodesh.
The veset by ones that does not establish on its own — and the position of the Tur:
The case
The rule
Source
She jumped and saw several times (the ones alone)
It is not a veset, for it is on account of the ones that she saw; and nonetheless she is concerned for it as for a non-fixed veset
מחבר סי״ז; and both parentheses are the רמ״א — one referring to תוס׳, רשב״א ור״ח, the other to הג״מ פ״ח
The ones joined to a fixed day (Rosh Chodesh, Sunday)
She has established a veset for the jumps of that day; without a jump on that day she is not concerned
מחבר סי״ח
Establishing a veset for the jumps alone, without the days
The Taz notes that the Mechaber here sets aside the view of the Tur, who holds there is a veset even for the jumps alone
ט״ז ס״ק ל״ב
The root of the distinction — why an ones alone does not establish: to establish a veset is to bring to light a nature of the body that sees at a given time. When the sighting proceeds from an external act (the jump), there is no revealing of a nature but the effect of an ones — and therefore, even repeated, the Mechaber says of it: « אינו וסת שמפני האונס ראתה » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:י״ז). But since a beginning of re'uta remains, the Rama adds that she is concerned for it as for a non-fixed veset. The Shakh specifies the exact reach of the exclusion:
« בכמה ימים כיון שלא קבעה אותו לימים ידועים כגון בר״ח או באחד בשבת כדלקמן סי״ח אינו וסת » (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק מ״ז) And the Taz notes that this rule is not accepted by all:
« אינו וסת שמפני האונס ראתה זה דלא כדעת הטור שפסק אפילו לקפיצות לחוד יש וסת » (ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ל״ב) Only when the ones is bound to a fixed time (three Rashei Chodashim) does the time join it to make it a veset — for then there is a side of nature. This is the depth of the gap between seif 17 and seif 18.
Concern from the first time, and signs that do not combine (seifim 21 to 26): the veset of the body, like all vesatot, is a matter of concern from the first time — seif 21 gives the general reason: « שכל וסת בין של ימים בין של הגוף חוששת לו בפעם אחת » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״א). And seif 26 sets out the full symmetry with the veset of days: « כשם שחוששת לוסת הימים בפעם אחת כך חוששת לוסת הגוף בפעם אחת » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ו). Finally seif 23 rules that the signs of the body do not combine with one another: « כל אלו הוסתות שנקבעים על ידי מקרה אין אחד קובע עם חבירו אלא כל שפיהקה שלש פעמים וראתה קבעה וסת אבל אם פיהקה פעם אחת ונתעטשה שתי פעמים אין מצטרפים » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ג) — one yawn and two sneezes do not make three. And the Rama adds the machloket of foods: « אכלה שום וראתה אכלה בצל וראתה אכלה פלפלין וראתה יש אומרים שקבעה לה וסת לראות ע״י כל אכילת דברים חמים » (רמ״א יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ג), against which he brings two further views — one assimilating it to an ones, the other to the veset of the body. The Rama brings these three views without deciding; we decide no more than he does.
8. Mesuleket damim — ketanah, zekenah, meuberet and menikah
« וכן זקנה שעברו עליה שלש עונות משהזקינה ולא ראתה הרי זו מסולקת דמים ואינה חוששת לוסתה הראשון » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ח)
Gloss of the Rama: « וקטנה וזקנה אינן חוששות לוסת שאינו קבוע » — ב״י בשם הרשב״א (רמ״א יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ח)
« מעוברת לאחר ג׳ חדשים לעיבורה ומניקה כל כ״ד חדש אחר לידת הולד אינה קובעת וסת אפי׳ מת הולד או גמלתו דמים מסולקים מהן כל זמן עיבורה וכל כ״ד חדש ומ״מ חוששת לראיה שתראה כדרך שחושש׳ לוסת שאינו קבוע » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ל״ג)
« מעובר׳ משהוכר עוברה ומניקה כל כ״ד חדש אינה חוששת לוסת הראשון אפילו היה לה וסת קבוע » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ל״ד)
Translation. Seif 28: "Likewise an elderly woman over whom three onot have passed since she aged without her seeing — she is mesuleket damim, and she is no longer concerned for her first veset." Gloss of the Rama: "and the ketanah and the zekenah are not concerned for a non-fixed veset." Seif 33: "A pregnant woman, after three months of pregnancy, and a nursing woman for the whole twenty-four months after the birth of the child, do not establish a veset — even if the child died or she weaned him — for their blood is withdrawn throughout the time of pregnancy and throughout the twenty-four months; and nonetheless she is concerned for any sighting she may have, as one is concerned for a non-fixed veset." Seif 34: "A pregnant woman once her pregnancy is apparent, and a nursing woman throughout the twenty-four months, are not concerned for the first veset, even if she had a fixed veset."
The foundation — what a "mesuleket damim" is.
In seifim 27 to 34 the siman deals with four states in which the body does not, by nature, see during that period: the tinoket / ketanah (seif 27), the zekenah (seifim 28 to 31), the meuberet and the menikah (seifim 33 and 34). Hence a principle of substance: the concern of a veset is nothing other than a chazakah of seeing; where the blood is withdrawn, that chazakah is abolished at its root — the body stands in a chazakah of withdrawal. The siman does not itself draw up a list of "four women"; this is our reading of the seifim cited.
The zekenah and the three onot — an uprooting by nature: an elderly woman does not become mesuleket through age itself, but through שלש עונות משהזקינה ולא ראתה(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ח) — again the logic of three: three interruptions uproot the chazakah of seeing. And from when is she called "elderly"? Seif 29 gives a criterion of reality, not of number: « שקורין לה אימא בפניה מחמת זקנותה » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ט) — one whom people call "mother" to her face on account of her age. And if she returns to seeing (seif 30): « חזרה וראתה דינה כדין תינוקת שלא הגיע זמנה לראות » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ל) — her status is that of a girl whose time to see has not yet come, and she begins to establish anew.
The stages of the pregnant and the nursing woman:
The stage
The rule
Source
Pregnant once the pregnancy is apparent, and nursing for twenty-four months
She is not concerned for the first veset, even if it was fixed; she needs no examination
מחבר סל״ד
After three months of pregnancy / during the twenty-four months of nursing
She does not establish a veset; the blood is withdrawn — even if the child died or she weaned him — and nonetheless she is concerned for a sighting as for a non-fixed veset
מחבר סל״ג
Once the days of pregnancy and nursing have passed
They return to being concerned for their first veset
מחבר סל״ד
Why the pregnant woman is more stringent than the zekenah — and the veset within a veset: the Taz notes the gap between seif 33 and seif 28, and gives the reason in the name of the Beit Yosef:
« בזה חמור דין מעוברת מדין זקינה שבסעיף כ״ח וכ׳ ב״י הטעם שזקינה אין לה דם בטבע משא״כ מעוברת שיש לה דם רק שהעובר מעכב ותכף שעברו ימי העיבור חזרה למקומה » (ט״ז יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק מ״ח) Translation: "in this the law of the pregnant woman is more stringent than that of the elderly woman of seif 28, and the Beit Yosef gives the reason: the elderly woman has no blood by nature, whereas the pregnant woman has blood, only the foetus holds it back; and as soon as the days of pregnancy have passed it returns to its place." Here is the foundation: a withdrawal by nature and a withdrawal by obstruction are not uprooted in the same way.
Moreover the tinoket / ketanah קובעת וסת כשאר נשים(שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:כ״ז) — three sightings for the other vesatot, four for the veset of intervals — "except that there is a difference between her and an adult." And seif 32 carries the chiddush of the וסת בתוך וסת: « פעמי׳ שהאשה קובעת לה וסת בתוך וסת כיצד ראתה שלש פעמים בראש חודש ורביעית בב׳ לחודש ובר״ח וכן בחמישית ובששית הרי קבעה שתי וסתות » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ל״ב) — three sightings on Rosh Chodesh, then a fourth, a fifth and a sixth in which she sees both on the 2nd of the month and on Rosh Chodesh: she has established two vesatot at once. The Shakh defends the reading "the 2nd of the month" against the variant "the 20th of the month" (ש״ך יו״ד קפ״ט ס״ק ע״ב).
Nafka mina — the return of the pregnant and the nursing woman (see siman 184): at the moment of transition — the end of nursing, childbirth — the chazakah of seeing returns, and upon it depend the laws of perishah samukh le-veset. Seif 34 says so: « עברו ימי העיבור וההנקה חוזרות לחוש לוסתן הראשון » (שולחן ערוך יו״ד קפ״ט:ל״ד). These moments of transition are especially delicate in practice, as is the whole calculation of establishing and uprooting in this siman — it is not done alone. And in practice — ask your Rav, and in matters of family purity a certified halakhic advisor as well.
The overarching chakirah of the siman: what is the nature of the concern for a veset, and how is the chazakah of seeing built and undone?
De-oraita or de-rabanan — the root of the whole siman. The siman does not decide it; the Shakh leans on the de-rabanan side to incline toward leniency, notably at ס״ק מ״ט, ע״ג and ע״ה.
The chazakah of three — establishing by three, uprooting by three; and the onah beinonit treated as a fixed veset by the force of the majority.
Intervals against days — the haflagah requires four sightings (the first does not enter the count); the veset of days makes do with three.
Dilug against sirug — in dilug the gap is the object; in sirug the date is fixed and the first sighting counts.
Veset of the body and ones — isolating the cause (הוברר הדבר); an ones alone does not establish, and the Taz notes that the Tur does not judge so.
Mesuleket damim — ketanah, zekenah, pregnant, nursing; the chazakah of seeing is abolished at its root, and the Taz distinguishes withdrawal by nature from withdrawal by obstruction.
Nafka mina for practice — as the seifim set it out:
No fixed veset → she is concerned for the onah beinonit (the thirtieth day), which has the status of a fixed veset as to the stringency of examination (מחבר ס״א וס״ד; ש״ך ס״ק ז׳).
Establishing by three like sightings; the veset of intervals — and the dilug of intervals — by four (מחבר ס״ב וס״ה; ט״ז ס״ק ג׳).
A veset is established within a single onah (day or night); day and night mixed → she is concerned for both, but the Taz shows the two concerns are not uprooted at the same price (מחבר סי״ג; ט״ז ס״ק ט״ו).
Uprooting a fixed veset only by three; a return to the old veset — even in one time, provided she did not establish another in the meantime (מחבר סט״ו–סט״ז; ש״ך ס״ק מ״ד).
A veset by ones alone does not establish, yet she is concerned for it (Rama); the veset of the body establishes by three, and the test of הוברר הדבר isolates the cause (מחבר סי״ז–סכ״ג; ש״ך ס״ק נ״ז–נ״ח).
Mesuleket damim — the zekenah after three onot; the pregnant woman once the pregnancy is apparent; the nursing woman for twenty-four months → she is not concerned, and returns at the end of the term (מחבר סכ״ח, סל״ג–סל״ד; ט״ז ס״ק מ״ח).
And in practice — the calculation of vesatot is extremely complex and is not done alone; ask your Rav.
Table — the ways of establishing a veset, and their rule
Type of veset
The rule / the count of sightings
Source
Onah beinonit (the 30th day)
A concern owed to women in general; the status of a fixed veset as to examination
מחבר ס״א וס״ד
Veset of intervals (הפלגות)
Four sightings (the first does not enter the count)
מחבר ס״ב
Veset of hours
She is concerned only for her hour; uprooted in one hour, even without examination
מחבר ס״ג
Veset of the days of the month / of the week
Three sightings at a fixed date
מחבר ס״ו
Dilug of intervals / of days
The first does not enter the count; four sightings
מחבר ס״ה וס״ז
Sirug
The first enters the count according to all
מחבר ס״ט וסי״ב
Veset of the body (yawning, etc.)
Three times; the signs do not combine with one another; concern from the first time
מחבר סי״ט–סכ״ג; רמ״א סכ״ג
Veset by ones alone
It is not a veset; and nonetheless she is concerned for it as for a non-fixed veset (Rama)
מחבר סי״ז ורמ״א שם
Table — mesuleket damim
The woman
The rule
Source
Ketanah / tinoket
She establishes like other women (three sightings, four for the intervals), and is not concerned for a non-fixed veset
מחבר סכ״ז; רמ״א סכ״ח
Zekenah (three onot without seeing)
Mesuleket damim; she is no longer concerned for her first veset
מחבר סכ״ח–סכ״ט
Pregnant (pregnancy apparent)
She is not concerned for the first veset, even if it was fixed
מחבר סל״ד
Nursing (twenty-four months)
The blood is withdrawn; she is concerned for a sighting as for a non-fixed veset
מחבר סל״ג
Table — central machlokot and chakirot
Subject
Side A
Side B
The nature of the concern for a veset
וסתות דאורייתא — a full chazakah of seeing
וסתות דרבנן — an instituted concern; the Shakh uses it for leniency, notably at ס״ק מ״ט, ע״ג and ע״ה
Counting the sightings in the intervals
The first does not enter the count (not being an interval)
In sirug — the first enters the count according to all
Veset by ones
An ones alone does not establish — this is the Mechaber's rule
The Tur holds there is a veset even for the jumps alone (ט״ז ס״ק ל״ב)
Uprooting a chazakah
Fixed — only by three
Non-fixed, and the veset of hours — in a single time
Table — the sources of the sugya
Gemara: נדה ס״ג ע״ב — the mishnah of establishing and uprooting three times · נדה ט׳ ע״א — the question of וסתות דאורייתא
Rishonim named in the siman or its commentaries: רשב״א (seif 4 and the Rama's gloss at seif 28) · תוס׳ · ר״ח · רמב״ם · רמב״ן · רא״ש · ראב״ד · טור · ב״י · הגהות מיימוניות (the Rama's gloss at seif 17) · מרדכי (the Rama's gloss at seif 23)
Commentaries consulted for this page: ש״ך (שפתי כהן) — seventy-six entries on this siman · ט״ז (טורי זהב) — fifty entries · בית יוסף · טור
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ DAAT · הרב יוסף חיים סממה
תלמיד חכם · מעביר שיעורים בהלכה ובחסידות סימן קפ״ט · Level 2 — Lamdan · דיני הווסתות daattorah.com
⚠️ This content is written for study and analysis only. The calculation of vesatot is complex and ramified; for any practical ruling (לְמַעֲשֶׂה) — ask your Rav, and in matters of family purity a certified halakhic advisor as well.